Blakes7

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5511 discussions

Re: [B7L] Re: fanfic etiquette query...
by Tigerm1019＠aol.com 08 Nov '01

08 Nov '01

In a message dated 11/07/2001 12:57:38 PM Central Standard Time, jeankomatsu(a)hotmail.com writes: > This is definitely plagiarism. I agree with Isobel Hamilton that Pat's > "Mixed Doubles" is probably the original and far superior. The plagiarized > untitled story is a clumsy attempt to repackage the storyline. Using this line of reasoning, William Shakespeare would be considered a plagiarist. More likely it's a case of two writers using the same very common premise, one far more effectively than the other. It is possible for different writers to come up with the same idea or for a writer to be unconsciously influenced by others. Plagiarism is an easy accusation to make, but very difficult to prove. In this case, there just isn't enough evidence to convince me beyond a reasonable amount of doubt. Tiger M

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Re: fanfic etiquette query...
by Ellynne G. 08 Nov '01

08 Nov '01

And (as the person who recently stole a great deal from Sir Arthur Conan Doyle), let us not forget that parody (at least in the U.S.) is generally protected. Hence, I have a fairly good case for writing, as a B7 story - [Exerpt from a letter K. Avon sent to his brother, I. Avon, just after death of Planetary Govenor, M. Sesar] It was the best of times (in Blakes opinion), it was the worst of times (in everyone else's). Marley Sesar was dead, to begin with and, as even Blake must acknowledge, it is a truth, universally (or galactically, at any rate) acknowledged that the sudden death of a high ranking official of the Federation, however unsuspicious it can be made to look, must be in want of an investigation. We came to pay Sesar, not to bury him. For, whether tis nobler in the mind for small nonconformist groups to suffer the slings and arrows of Outrageous Fortune* or to take arms against a sea of troubles and by opposing end them, tis cheaper and safer to bail them out and not show up in court. But, as Blake said, because we could not stop for death, death kindly stopped for he. When we entered, Marley Sesar stood by the window, and frowned to see below the happy bands of monks and nuns absconding through the snow. A while he stood there watching and 'envying them all . . .' (Quoth fearless leader evermore [or for the past week and still going strong]). When through the window big and red there hurtled at his much swelled head, and bounced and knocked him on his bed, an India-rubber ball! "Precipitous, precipitous, precipitous!" the govenor cried. "My, precipitous! Oh, my, precipitous!" And with that, even as his eyes were lifted up to gloat upon his prize (rubber balls being much prized there), the jabberwock** with eyes of flame, came whiffling through the tulgey wood*** He sobbed and he sighed, and a gurgle he gave, then he threw himself into the billowy wave. Blake thinks this is a good thing. "Who'd stoop to blame _this_ sort of trifling?" he says. I don't know how much more I can take. Vila and I are going to open a cask of amontilado. As soon as you get a chance, call me, Ishmael. Your brother, K.A. *Famous attack ship of the Seventh Fleet which captured the Followers of the Sacred Hand Grenade (a religious order whose philosophy strongly influenced various rebel leaders). **No, I don't know why he kept one for a pet. ***An inferior building material if ever there was one. ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/.

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Re: [B7L] re: Dorian's room
by J MacQueen 08 Nov '01

08 Nov '01

>From: "Dana Shilling" <dshilling(a)worldnet.att.net> >This week, on Changing Rooms, Avon and Dorian.... <yelp> <hasty placement of virtual hands over mind's eye> <yelp again> Regards Joanne (scared now...) _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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Fwd: Re: [B7L] Re: fanfic etiquette query...
by Sally Manton 08 Nov '01

08 Nov '01

Dana wrote: <In C21 US copyright law, there is a defense known as "scene a faire" (obligatory scene)--that is, a theme or series of events that is used so often in a genre that it cannot be considered the property of any particular writer. <snip> I daresay that, as mentioned, Fertility Festival (with or without Aphrodisiac chaser) qualifies.> Absolutely :-), as is the aphrodisiac plot with or without the Fertility Festival. There's just too many of them, good and bad, to say *this* particular story is where the idea came from (it could even have come from a story on a different fandom's website). I hate to be a bitch, but I couldn't help thinking that had the second writer *been* consciously copying Pat's story, her own would have to picked up a few bits of decent writing as well ... _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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re: Dorian's room
by Alison Page 08 Nov '01

08 Nov '01

Andrew said - >>it adds another twist to the "Avon goes mad in s4" theory. The room "accepts" Avon; it affects/controls Dorian ("By now I probably would be"), etc. Perhaps not all the "madness & rotting corruption" settled back on Dorian when the creature was destroyed Nice one. I never thought of that. A festering presence. Alison ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.mimesweeper.com **********************************************************************

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Fwd: Re: [B7L] Re: Rumours of Death script on Ebay
by Sally Manton 08 Nov '01

08 Nov '01

Betty wrote: <Seems like it might have been worth it just for that line!> Yes, quite neat :-) but the rest isn't too good - very heavy-handed. I'm not surprised it was cut. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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Re: FC: Rumours of Death script on Ebay
by Harriet Monkhouse 07 Nov '01

07 Nov '01

Joyce reported on the appearance of the RoD camera script on eBay... Meanwhile, you may remember that some of us bought the ordinary script from Chris Boucher, and he then got in a bit of a state because he decided it didn't have a missing scene never broadcast as he'd claimed. But on closer examination, we discovered there were about 16 lines of Grenlee and Forres which don't appear in the final version, so we closed a deal with him after all. I'm not saying this is totally new to fandom - a couple of us had a vague feeling we'd heard of such a fragment before, so it may well be in circulation. But I certainly hadn't seen it , so presume plenty of others won't have either. It follows on from the (present) end of the first Grenlee and Forres scene. That now goes from FORRES: May I never leave this spot. GRENLEE: That can be arranged, Section Leader. to Avon and Vila discussing arrangements for taking Shrinker down to the cave. In this, F and G continue: FORRES: Major Grenlee? GRENLEE: Mmm? FORRES: What's the President like? GRENLEE: Her own way mostly, why? FORRES: No I mean what's she like as a person? GRENLEE: She isn't a person. She's a president. FORRES: And a woman. GRENLEE: Idle speculation section leader. FORRES: I wonder what makes her so special though? When you think about it there's thousands of men ready to die for her. GRENLEE: Every man needs something to believe in Forres. There are no exceptions to that. It's a universal rule. FORRES: If you say so, sir. GRENLEE: I do say so. Just be grateful you joined the service and you don't have to worry about what to believe in. It's all laid out for you. FORRES: Oh I am grateful, sir. GRENLEE: I mean it. Some men have to find their own faith. FORRES: Tough. GRENLEE: It can be section leader. There's only one thing more dangerous than a man looking for something to believe in. And that's a man who thinks he's found something. (Then back to Avon and Vila.) -- Harriet "Nox est perpetua una dormienda." - Catullus V

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new Barbara Paul short story
by Julia Jones 07 Nov '01

07 Nov '01

Golden Retriever, the second story featuring reluctant private investigator Callie Darrow, is on the US newsstands now in the Dec issue of Ellery Queen. I haven't had a chance to read it yet, so I don't know if there are any fannish references other than the lead character's name. -- Julia Jones "Science is not about building a body of known 'facts'. It is a method for asking awkward questions and subjecting them to a reality-check, thus avoiding the human tendency to believe whatever makes us feel good." - The Science of Discworld

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Re: fanfic etiquette query...
by Isobel Hamilton 07 Nov '01

07 Nov '01

OK well it certainly looks as though I won't be contacting authors - too many varying opinions I think. But anyone else is welcome to! I do still think that this is a case of one author copying the idea of another, but I appreciate that perhaps it's not enough to be described as plagiarism. I know if I wrote the original and read the other on some other site I would think they had just copied my idea... Susan Beth - you're absolutely right that it does make a fascinating way to compare authors, and good and bad fanfic. Pat's characterisation (and writing and style) is perfect, and the other author's... is... not. Jean - >I have a sentimental weakness for the Avon-Cally "romance that never was" me too - having just been re-watching various episodes I could go on about 100 tiny moments which I'm sure are entirely coincidental! Perhaps I will indulge myself on my website.. However I've yet to find a fic which really appeals to me on the A-C theme (I'm not sure if this is because I haven't looked thoroughly enough yet! And I don't think I'll attempt to write my own..) Sally - >from the website, the second writer has a thing for badly written >Avon-Cally stories I attempted to read a couple of the other ones and basically had to give up, it was sacriledge having two beloved characters speak such things! I see there is an area for feedback on the ff.net site, perhaps it might be worth leaving a speculative comment about the story similarities? Isobel ------------------------------------------ Dayna: Avon why do you keep everything to yourself? Why so secretive? Avon: Perhaps I'm shy. ------------------------------------------ _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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Fwd: [B7L] Re: fanfic etiquette query...
by Jean Komatsu 07 Nov '01

07 Nov '01

This is definitely plagiarism. I agree with Isobel Hamilton that Pat's "Mixed Doubles" is probably the original and far superior. The plagiarized untitled story is a clumsy attempt to repackage the storyline. Let's put it this way, if this were tried in college, writer #2 would be flunked and reprimanded. Actually, I myself took Pat's story as a writing exercise -- I have a sentimental weakness for the Avon-Cally "romance that never was" and tried to finish it. I liked the way it came out, although it's a stretch to imagine the "real" (e.g., TV-based) Avon ever softening even a little bit. I wanted to send it to Pat as a tribute to her, but being a newbie at writing, have been much too chicken to do so. It just sits on my PC; every once in a while I drag it out and 'improve' it with a word change or two. But I would never dream of changing the title or eliminating her name on it. She deserves all the credit for suggesting an interesting possibility twist to the B7 fanfic universe. While I was writing it, in fact, I thought I understood why she didn't finish it. It's never been clear to me exactly how long the period was between the date of Cally's exile and when she joined the Liberator. But even considering how isolationist Auron was and how homophobic the Earth-based Federation had become, it was hard to write believably that Cally was so ignorant of human sexuality. Maybe she was just "all business" when it came to the Revolution! But absolutely, the second author should be ashamed of his/her self. Let us hope the error was made in ignorance, although I rather doubt it. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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