Leah wrote:

In a message dated 3/8/01 7:53:45 PM Eastern Standard Time, littles@lycos.co.uk writes:

<< Leah wrote: > In a message dated 3/8/01 8:27:26 AM Eastern Standard Time, Shame writes:<<

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Evidently you can't spell. Or else that was a Freudian slip.<

It was a typo. But if the shoe fits, by all means...

Well, you wear it then.

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Vague threats? It was a statement.<<

Whatever you intended, it was a moot point. Some of the most skilled slash artists was chosen by some of the actors to illustrate their books, video cover art,

Videos? Books? You suggesting the actors are all in the porn trade? Get a grip.

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What are you on about? A few people have mentioned a dispute in the early

nineties in which slash artwork played a big role. But I don't care about that. I wasn't even _in_ fandom then; why should I? As usual, Leah, you've misunderstood completely.<<

So very typical of you, Shane. If you've never been affected by something, and have little or no actual knowledge of the facts concerning the issue, you "don't care." That's called deliberately flaunting your ignorance.

No, that's called not getting involved in a discussion which involves things which I don't know about. Oh, I've heard stories of course, but all they say to me is that there's two sides to the dispute... so I'm leaving any discussion of that fight to the people who were there.

The topic here was the reprehensible presence of adult fan art,

I never said "reprehensible." But that's another good word. Glad to see you've taken Kingpin's advice and gotten out your dictionary.

either from my pen or anywhere on the Ashton Press website. The answer is that there never were any repercussions from adult fanfic or fan art,

That wasn't what I've heard (ask yourself why Horizon and Avon Club don't carry or even advertise slash at all), but then, once again, repercussions were never at issue here. Leah, you really should start _reading_ these e-mails.

and no dire warnings from you or anyone else will bring about a sense of trepidation.

Dire warnings? From whom, pray? All I said was "I'd be careful if I were you." Which can have any number of meanings. If you choose to take it that way, then fine.

In short, you're wasting your time, and probably annoying some of the many fans present who do write, read or otherwise enjoy adult fanfic and art.

Well, I'm annoying _you_, certainly. But you brought it up.

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The explicit artwork to which I was referring was at

http://hometown.aol.com/pelkiepet/socomfort.htm. I would assume that the zine itself contains somewhat more of same, would you care to confirm or deny this?<<

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! You actually think these pictures are 'explicit'?

Well, I've seen much worse in the real world, but it's B7 fandom that's at issue here, not porn in general.

Everyone, PLEASE, I beg of you to go immediately to the above-referenced site and witness the horrible depravity

Well, at least you admit it.

of the pictures present, including the mock cover of the B7 "lurid romance novel" that everyone was having so much fun with on this list, a couple of years ago.

That would be the cover illo of Vila, Blake and Avon in bed together, would it?

And while you're there, make sure you see all the horrible references to MORE pornographic illustrations by me, blatantly stated on that web page!

Thanks for bringing that up. I didn't.

Cover the eyes of the young-uns! Lock up the horses! Oh my God, it's...it's...depravity! ROTFL!

If it involves young'uns, horses, and you laughing, I'd say that's accurate...

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Were the actors aware of

all of it? Why yes, they were.<<

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Why bring the actors into it? I didn't mention them, and you should maybe

take a look at Archive Message #44056 on the subject. But since you do mention them, in the past two weeks, several people, both pro and anti slash, have spoken out on the Lyst about how they personally, or people they know, find such artwork distasteful, or about why such pictures can be upsetting, or even damaging, to the actors, their families and their careers (e.g. Julia in #44065, 2001-02-28 23:05, Neil in #44228, 2001-03-01 22:40).<<

Distaste is not a basis for censorship. It's a motivation for avoidance of that which one finds distasteful.

It's not a question of censorship, is it? It's a question of common courtesy, and of taking people's personal feelings into account.

If they don't want to look at slash art or fiction, then they won't buy it or visit sites that feature it. End of conflict.

Why did they feel obliged to speak up about it then? I doubt either Neil or Julia can be accused of prudery.

As for damage to the actor's careers, well my oh my, you haven't visited the sites of some other fandoms lately, have you?

That's your excuse, is it? Somebody else is doing it so therefore it's justified?

But that's beside the point. Other fandoms are not at issue here. B7 fandom _is_. Keep to the topic.

Adult fanfic is actually the norm, rather than the exception.

For whom?

And some of the actors we are discussing have done far more damage to their own careers with poor decisions and behavior than any run of a fanzine could ever have dreamed of.

You really do hate them, don't you? Why do you keep making personal attacks on the actors, especially after Steve asked everyone to leave them out of it?

They didn't need any help at all. No need to feel you've been appointed the official protector.

Never said I felt that way, and I'm not trying to protect anyone. I'm just asking why your publisher's site shows pictures of B7 actors in compromising positions, without asking their permission. And why not? Afraid they might not give it?

"Those who choose to ignore history are doomed to repeat it."

Oh, coming from you, that's _rich_.

Shane

"You really are insane, aren't you?" --Avon